New Zealand gun ban meets with massive non-compliance

[n0rlf]

Why does a background check even care what the firearm is? Is any gun going to make a difference in a standard bgc? Nope, just a backdoor way of registration.

Nowhere during the background check is any model of firearm, or serial # mentioned. Simply the owner’s name, birthday, and SS number[optional]. He could buy a Ruger 10 22, or Scar 17. The background people never know what is being purchased. Also, after 72 hours, any records of the background check must be purged from the FDLE system. And should a gun be found at the scene of a crime, the police have no idea who it belongs to. They must call the mfr, say S&W, & ask them who did they ship 9 mm Shield, ser # ABC123 to. They will reply Davidson’s. Then the police will call Davidson’s & ask the same question. They will reply Bob’s Gun Shop. Then the police will call Bob’s, & ask the same question. They will reply Jim Smith bought the gun. Remember, the 4473’s sit in the gunstore until the owner retires, or sells the store. So there is no database on who owns what. The exception is for a multiple handgun purchase. Then the ATF is notified immediately that Jim Smith bought 2 handguns with all the details, & serial numbers. GARY.

True, but the 4473 has the info so there is a defacto registration from BGC. That is the whole point in my opinion. So when the BATF walks into a gun store and grabs all f the 4473 files the information is in their hands. And if you think a BGC disappears totally after 72 hours, well, I need to explain how a relational database really works. Do you really trust that the .gov is doing it correctly? I do not trust them to get anything right so i just take it for granted they are keeping the info. Paranoid? maybe, but plan for the worst, hope for the best.

[GunsandHoses]

Why does a background check even care what the firearm is? Is any gun going to make a difference in a standard bgc? Nope, just a backdoor way of registration.

Nowhere during the background check is any model of firearm, or serial # mentioned. Simply the owner’s name, birthday, and SS number[optional]. He could buy a Ruger 10 22, or Scar 17. The background people never know what is being purchased. Also, after 72 hours, any records of the background check must be purged from the FDLE system. And should a gun be found at the scene of a crime, the police have no idea who it belongs to. They must call the mfr, say S&W, & ask them who did they ship 9 mm Shield, ser # ABC123 to. They will reply Davidson’s. Then the police will call Davidson’s & ask the same question. They will reply Bob’s Gun Shop. Then the police will call Bob’s, & ask the same question. They will reply Jim Smith bought the gun. Remember, the 4473’s sit in the gunstore until the owner retires, or sells the store. So there is no database on who owns what. The exception is for a multiple handgun purchase. Then the ATF is notified immediately that Jim Smith bought 2 handguns with all the details, & serial numbers. GARY.

True, but the 4473 has the info so there is a defacto registration from BGC. That is the whole point in my opinion. So when the BATF walks into a gun store and grabs all f the 4473 files the information is in their hands. And if you think a BGC disappears totally after 72 hours, well, I need to explain how a relational database really works. Do you really trust that the .gov is doing it correctly? I do not trust them to get anything right so i just take it for granted they are keeping the info. Paranoid? maybe, but plan for the worst, hope for the best.

+1!!!

[P5 Guy]

Have you bought a firearm from the Civilian Marksmanship Program?

[Firemedic2000]

Why do so many people believe there is no national registry in the US? If the feds can track the ownership of firearms used in a crime through multiple owners, there is a registry. Consider the simply idea of tracking any brand or model by consecutive serial numbers. Every new firearm went through the FFL registration. Every purchaser would be identified by name and address. They may miss a few old firearms or something passed through generations or yard sales but they would get the vast majority. That's part of the clamor for universal background checks for ALL transfers, sales, gifts. Find out where the firearms are and who has them.

You right they can track through multiple owners. That's a tremendous amount of leg work. But at one point it get's sold without paper work in a ftf transaction. Not through an FFL there are tens of thousands transactions if not hundreds of thousands of these transactions a year.

Gun registration is a spot on tracking system. That let's the government know exactly who, what and where each gun is in real time. Hugh difference

[Firemedic2000]

Dlb tap

[Firemedic2000]

Nowhere during the background check is any model of firearm, or serial # mentioned. Simply the owner’s name, birthday, and SS number[optional]. He could buy a Ruger 10 22, or Scar 17. The background people never know what is being purchased. Also, after 72 hours, any records of the background check must be purged from the FDLE system. And should a gun be found at the scene of a crime, the police have no idea who it belongs to. They must call the mfr, say S&W, & ask them who did they ship 9 mm Shield, ser # ABC123 to. They will reply Davidson’s. Then the police will call Davidson’s & ask the same question. They will reply Bob’s Gun Shop. Then the police will call Bob’s, & ask the same question. They will reply Jim Smith bought the gun. Remember, the 4473’s sit in the gunstore until the owner retires, or sells the store. So there is no database on who owns what. The exception is for a multiple handgun purchase. Then the ATF is notified immediately that Jim Smith bought 2 handguns with all the details, & serial numbers. GARY.

True, but the 4473 has the info so there is a defacto registration from BGC. That is the whole point in my opinion. So when the BATF walks into a gun store and grabs all f the 4473 files the information is in their hands. And if you think a BGC disappears totally after 72 hours, well, I need to explain how a relational database really works. Do you really trust that the .gov is doing it correctly? I do not trust them to get anything right so i just take it for granted they are keeping the info. Paranoid? maybe, but plan for the worst, hope for the best.

He's right you know. I sit in on an atf audit once. Well not sit in, but was there and watch her and saw exactly what she was writing down. She tried to hide what she was doing also. They or should I say she. Wrote down every bit of info off of every single 4473 in the shop. She accounted for and wrote down every serial number and buyers info of every gun that went through that shop.

She was at the shop for well over a week.

WHY DID SHE DO THAT.

[Cubanstang50]

Why does a background check even care what the firearm is? Is any gun going to make a difference in a standard bgc? Nope, just a backdoor way of registration.

Nowhere during the background check is any model of firearm, or serial # mentioned. Simply the owner’s name, birthday, and SS number[optional]. He could buy a Ruger 10 22, or Scar 17. The background people never know what is being purchased. Also, after 72 hours, any records of the background check must be purged from the FDLE system. And should a gun be found at the scene of a crime, the police have no idea who it belongs to. They must call the mfr, say S&W, & ask them who did they ship 9 mm Shield, ser # ABC123 to. They will reply Davidson’s. Then the police will call Davidson’s & ask the same question. They will reply Bob’s Gun Shop. Then the police will call Bob’s, & ask the same question. They will reply Jim Smith bought the gun. Remember, the 4473’s sit in the gunstore until the owner retires, or sells the store. So there is no database on who owns what. The exception is for a multiple handgun purchase. Then the ATF is notified immediately that Jim Smith bought 2 handguns with all the details, & serial numbers. GARY.

Question.. i bought 2 guns at once one time and my ffl told me this. What does this do different than if i just bought 1 gun? Dont really understand the reason for notifying 2 or more guns bought at the same time.

[N4KVE]

Had you purchased one gun, the 4473 sits in the gun shop until hell freezes over. If you purchase 2 handguns at one time, the gun store immediately sends a form directly to the ATF notifying them of the transaction with model/serial number details on both guns. GARY.

[ss1]

Question.. i bought 2 guns at once one time and my ffl told me this. What does this do different than if i just bought 1 gun? Dont really understand the reason for notifying 2 or more guns bought at the same time.

It’s to help track straw purchasers. Particularly if you buy 2 of the same handguns. In the extreme example, if someone walks into a gun store in Philly and buys 10 Glock 19s, odds are they are going to NYC. The ATF draws the line at 2 handguns and requires FFLs to report multiple handgun purchases.

[N4KVE]

And this happened to a friend once. He purchased 2 handguns at the same time. A week later the ATF rang his doorbell. They wanted to see both guns. My friend showed them that he still had both guns, & they replied “have a nice day”, & left. It’s when you don’t have the guns to show them that the problems begin. GARY.