Miramar Shootout

[wjbarricklow]

Short version. Two robbers shoot up a jewelry store in Coral Gables, then carjack a UPS driver, taking him with them. The police pursue the UPS truck into Broward County where the robbers get hung up in traffic in Miramar. on a busy street. Cops get out to confront the robbers, get shot at and return fire. They kill the robbers, UPS guy, and an old man in a Crown Vic who was just stuck in traffic.

Shitty situation, a lot of confusion through multiple jurisdictions. Still it seems like a dumb move to jump out out of the car, and confront the robbers.

One thing I learned from this. If you see something like this, get out. I don't care who you have to push out of the way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGnKMoRszFk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L__8BdKwtGY

[rug357]

Hoplite’s Armor response to the event...
This is his response on FB.

“My name is Lyman Bishop. I'm the Founder and CEO of Hoplite Armor, as well as the engineer responsible for the design and development of all our custom armor solutions. I'm also the man responsible for posting various things online that have recently offended a lot of police officers.

First let me say I am not anti police as many would have you believe, but rather I put the the American people first in every circumstance. I believe in the United States Constitution and as such I recognize that it is We the People who are, or should be, in full control of this nation. If We the People take issue with our government or law enforcement, it is our right, even our sacred duty, to speak out boldly and without concern for the consequences brought on by tyrants.

Over the last few days I have been slandered, lied about, conspired against and even threatened with physical harm, by police officers, for speaking out against the events in Florida where police opened fire on 2 criminals in stand still traffic using civilians as human shields, resulting in the Deaths of 2 innocent people. UPS driver Frank Ordonez and Family Man Richard Cutshaw.

The idea that such a thing could happen on US soil is almost beyond belief, but what's worse is the position of many of those in law enforcement who show no remorse and target those of us who speak out.

Whenever the people stand up against police misconduct we are told to mind our own business, to stay in our lane or that we are Monday Morning Quarterbacks. We are told that unless we have done the job ourselves we have no right to speak out. This is heresy! We the People have every right to speak up against anything that takes place in this country, or for that matter, anything on the planet. Make no mistake, this event will prove to be the defining moment where people take sides. Youre either a bootlicking, redcoat or a free citizen of the United States.

We the People are the single most powerful and influential group of people that has ever existed. We are better educated, and better armed than any group of people that has ever existed and the world would be wise not to stand in our way. That includes our so called authorities here at home.

For too long we have sat idly by and allowed our nation to be picked apart by vultures. Now is the time to stand up and be counted. For years I have felt called by God to run for Governor of Montana but I had to wait for the right time. That time has finally come and I would encourage all of you who are like minded to do the same in your states. What office you seek is unimportant. Only that you get involved and take back whatever power you can. Its time we take back our country and our rightful place in the world.

My position is simple, the rights of the people shall not be infringed. If I am elected we will have constitutional carry for every law abiding citizen on day one. I will also ban the National Firearms Act. The very thought that our rights should be held hostage, subject to bureaucratic paperwork and fees is an abomination to our traditions and our culture of freedom and individual liberties.

Where we go from here is not up to me. I will leave it to you, the People, to decide our fate, but I can promise you one thing. There are NO other candidates, in Montana or anywhere else, that are willing to draw a line in the sand and put themselves in between you and tyranny like I will.

God bless America

Lyman Bishop”

[rug357]

It was an surprising response by the LEO. It’s what I expected to see in some third world country.
A total cluster f

[Taco]

Let's Monday morning QB this... I have 4 points to decide a path. Interested in the boards opinions.

2 guys in a stolen UPS truck, presumably armed, with the driver as a hostage.

Decision point #1- Do you pursue? Only until air support arrives?

Vehicle stopped due to traffic, may or may not be disabled...

Decision point #2- Do you grab them out of the vehicle? Alternative would be hanging back and waiting for the chase to continue, wait for them to come out voluntarily?

The guys decide they ain't goin to jail... Takes shots at now on foot officers... Approximately some approximately 20 ft, limited cover, limited concealment.

Decision point #3- Do you return fire, do you retreat?

Decision point #4- Other police open fire, you have a reasonable shot, let's call it 20 ft head on, and he is facing and shooting out the door, do you open fire as well?

[Tenzing_Norgay]

Let's Monday morning QB this... I have 4 points to decide a path. Interested in the boards opinions.

2 guys in a stolen UPS truck, presumably armed, with the driver as a hostage.

Decision point #1- Do you pursue? Only until air support arrives?

Vehicle stopped due to traffic, may or may not be disabled...

Decision point #2- Do you grab them out of the vehicle? Alternative would be hanging back and waiting for the chase to continue, wait for them to come out voluntarily?

The guys decide they ain't goin to jail... Takes shots at now on foot officers... Approximately some approximately 20 ft, limited cover, limited concealment.

Decision point #3- Do you return fire, do you retreat?

Decision point #4- Other police open fire, you have a reasonable shot, let's call it 20 ft head on, and he is facing and shooting out the door, do you open fire as well?

On a busy, rush-hour traffic-packed roadway with hundreds of innocent bystanders, you pull back and observe. Get the truck boxed-in and call in a SWAT sniper.

Doesn't the rule "be aware of your background" apply to po-po or does that only apply to us civvies with hunting rifles?

[tcpip95]

They probably could have picked a better spot along the 30-mile chase to do this. It's simply amazing that only two innocent people died here. Granted, nobody envisioned a shootout, but to spray the truck the way they did was nuts. They simply sacrificed the UPS driver.

[gforester]

Bet dollars to donuts that scum bag lawyers are already swarming like a pack of vultures around the family's of the deceased.

[Skoll]

Red coats are alive and well while wearing blue these days.

[Joecruiser]

I'm surprised this is the first thread on this incident.
My office is on the 3rd floor of City Hall, above where a stray bullet pierced the window of the city clerks office.
The alley where the bad guys approached from (rear of store) I traverse it daily.

I state the above not to brag but to provide context.

Here's my take:
The LEOs that APPROACHED the threat thereby neutralize it deserved medles of honor!
Sad for the collateral damage BUT cops are NOW trained to run to the source of fire....
You'll want another MSD....look at the "coward of Broward"...he was waiting for SWAT and hostage negotiators.

The bad guys chose to stop at that location...they could've easily bashed and rammed across.
They were either stopping to surrender....highly unlikely.
Or, as many believe,
Make it their last stand and blow away as many civilians as their ammo supply permitted.

Then, public opinion would've been, "more cowards of Broward...Dade too.

So don't bash the cops. I DEMAND they rush the threat

Edit: I am not privy to the investigation as the FBI is in charged.
Irregardless, Gables PD would not be handling the case as it involved multiple homicides and the Gables does not have a Homicide Unit. Miami-Dade County PD, of which 13 out of the 19 that discharged their weapon are from, would be the lead investigation unit.

[Skoll]

I'm surprised this is the first thread on this incident.
My office is on the 3rd floor of City Hall, above where a stray bullet pierced the window of the city clerks office.
The alley where the bad guys approached from (rear of store) I traverse it daily.

I state the above not to brag but to provide context.

Here's my take:
The LEOs that APPROACHED the threat thereby neutralize it deserved medles of honor!
Sad for the collateral damage BUT cops are NOW trained to run to the source of fire....
You'll want another MSD....look at the "coward of Broward"...he was waiting for SWAT and hostage negotiators.

The bad guys chose to stop at that location...they could've easily bashed and rammed across.
They were either stopping to surrender....highly unlikely.
Or, as many believe,
Make it their last stand and blow away as many civilians as their ammo supply permitted.

Then, public opinion would've been, "more cowards of Broward...Dade too.

So don't bash the cops. I DEMAND they rush the threat

Edit: I am not privy to the investigation as the FBI is in charged.
Irregardless, Gables PD would not be handling the case as it involved multiple homicides and the Gables does not have a Homicide Unit. Miami-Dade County PD, of which 13 out of the 19 that discharged their weapon are from, would be the lead investigation unit.

They showed horrible judgement and training fundamentals. This isn't monday morning quarterbacking but actual fact. Not only were they reckless and needlessly endangered innocent lives, but they practically human sacrificed the UPS driver. I don't know what the fuck it is you're smoking, but the fact that you're ok with this is appalling.